How Do I Turn?

[bauerb]

there is an exercise principle called Muscular Endurance(ME). its basically strength training with high reps over a longer period of time. single leg box steps and single leg lunges are good examples of specific exercises. at the end of September I started doing these 2 exercises. I found it nearly impossible to do 10 good box steps with each leg, and I had to hold on to something for balance and use my trailing leg to give a big push off the floor. I was extremely sore for about a week. 8 weeks later and I am doing these two exercises for a total of 540 reps, 3 sets of 180 in between running interval sets. I am training for racing, but the ME principle is exactly the same for Tele. I also use a padded step-up box which requires activation of all the little "balance muscles". we all talk about quads as the major muscle, but the little ancillary muscles also cause fatigue. I can now balance on the padded box without holding onto a rail, and I don't require a push from my trailing leg. ME sets produce the same burn you feel when tele skiing. if you want to start doing ME, start slow and make sure to stretch.

[joeatomictoad]

Even so, my quads will feel the burn from staying in the tele stance for long periods.

Yes, but 'tis skiing... mountains, snow, gravity, acceleration... worth the burn for me. Also, if I can do all of this with lower probability of ACL injury, then I just doubled-down on why I pursue tele.

[Stephen]

I see a lot of bouncing up and down in that video. It is less work to change leads while maintaining a constant upper body “ height above snow”.
.
.

A long time ago, I read an article about two types of unweighting.
Forget the names used, but:
I think one was UP unweighting, that involves an up and down motion in the upper body, and;
The other I think was DOWN unweighting, where the body does not move up and down. Here, one builds energy in the legs in the turn, and then releases that energy for the unweighting, letting the legs spring back up towards the stable body.
Hope that makes sense…

I like the second technique most of the time. Sometimes up unweighting is needed to get the skis out of the snow.

Interested what others think on this.

[Stephen]

there is an exercise principle called Muscular Endurance(ME).
.
single leg box steps and single leg lunges are good examples of specific exercises. at the end of September I started doing these 2 exercises. I found it nearly impossible to do 10 good box steps with each leg,
.
.

@bauerb, Do you have any links to this?
With the shape you must be in, I am not visualizing what the movement is that was so hard in the beginning.

Would like to check it out.
Thanks for posting.

[Montana St Alum]

Here is an example of box steps.

https://outdoorfitnesssociety.com/worko ... -workouts/


Even for a fit person, if you are older, I'd start small (height) and easy (no weights) for a while just so you don't induce an injury.

[bauerb]

running in general uses a very limited range of motion. sky running with steep vert uses a bit more ROM. the way I do box steps uses a complete ROM. pushing your entire body weight up using a single leg, through full ROM was very hard in the beginning. I weigh about 190lbs, so a 1 leg step up would be similar to a 380lb deep squat. thats a fair bit of weight.
there are different ways to do step-ups. what I do is not exactly a "step up" because I stand on the side of the box, not head-on( like you climb stairs). I do it this way because I want to maximize the vertical effort by minimizing the forward thrust of head-on step up. basically I am trying to make the box step as hard as possible. I am also using a padded box as opposed to solid wood. the padding gives enough to require all of the little stabilizer muscles to come into play, and this makes the motion much harder. if you ever have worked on in the gym and used free weights vs machines, you know that free weights are much harder( because of the smaller stabilizer muscles being called into action).

I purchased a step box that is a rectangle. the step height is printed on each side so that you can adjust the height( I was going to build a box, but the price of plywood is so high it was basically the same price to buy a better box)

in these pics you can see the box I use, and how I stand next to the box, not if front of it. the step motion should be slow and controlled up and down. this is not about building "cheat" momentum and launching off the floor with your trailing foot.

these step ups start to burn by the 10th rep on one leg, and I have to push through the burn to get to 15 reps per leg.

In between 20 min uphill run intervals at 90%, I do:
- 3x15( per leg) box steps
- 3x15( per leg) lunges

do 3 run interval and 3 sets of ME( 540 total reps).
this week I added a 1x3 max effort at the end of my last 20 min run interval( 23 mins total)

this workout is hard. I only do it 2x per week, with 2 full days in between(eg Tues and Friday)

if you want more info on ME Strength, a good source is a search on UphillAthlete.com

note what MSU says: start with a small box height, no weights. if you are not used to this full ROM exercise you will be very sore in the beginning. start very slow and easy, build up over time. it took me 7 weeks to get to 540 reps.

[Stephen]

@bauerb, @Montana St Alum, Thanks — I think…

[oggopoggo]

A long time ago, I read an article about two types of unweighting.
I think one was UP unweighting, that involves an up and down motion in the upper body, and;
The other I think was DOWN unweighting, where the body does not move up and down.

Almost another thread but anyway. That’s right, both part of well rounded technique. Mashed potatoes with skinny skis are a classic place to upweight. While packed moguls are “better” down unweighted, up weighting can be a lifesaver. The difference gets slightly blurry if you get into race style carving. Your upper body remains level but highly angulated and skis are projected out to the side by extension of the legs. Search Sprint telemark for a look, mostly Europeans.

Todays ski designs have a huge effect on how to ski so it is a matter of knowing your own equipment.

[lowangle al]

I agree with the beginner approach of starting on a smooth bunny hill and alternating leading feet without turning at first. if you can't balance going straight, you cannot balance in turns.

If I could go back to the mid 80s when I first tried this drill I would have spent 10 hours on it instead of the maybe 10 minutes I put into it at the time. I think it could have shaved 10 years off of my learning curve.

Yes indeed! x10


158C82FA-1755-4872-AFA9-504C88CC4653.gif
(The Telemark Movie)

Proper tele position + weighting & unweighting + rhythm + fore/aft balance + side to side balance + hand position…

100% indispensable beginner learning exercise and practice drill(throughout your tele career!).

Pro Tip: In high resistance snow situations, start your descent by straight line running directly down the fall line like this, to gather momentum and rhythm, then add turning effort as required.

[lowangle al]

Here is an old thread on how to turn. I specifically wanted to show the lead change drill. Go to the above post in this thread and watch the clip for an idea of how it's done. I'd start lower angle though.