kom vs Fischer Sbound 125 advice please

[wabene]

Yes @Rickg707 I agree with FE. I put a Voile 3 Pin Cable binding on my 98 and it is a great all-around backcountry ski. Heading out into unknown terrain looking for turns and some vertical this is the ski I'll grab. Pulling a toboggan into a cabin for a ski getaway? Slap a skin on it. Likey.

[lilcliffy]

to answer some of the questions and provide more context- I think the bc 80s are ok. I bought them during covid so selection wasn't great and they're probably one size smaller than they could be. I got the hoks bc they looked like fun and I thought shorter and wider would be better than longer/thinner. I took them both on a trip to the Maine woods. hoks were great for breaking trail, and very maneuverable in the woods. the downhills were mellower than I expected for the trip I was on and the hoks didnt glide too well. then came the end of the downhill. we had 4 miles back to camp. everyone else skied back. mine was more of a hike. next day, I was on the Rossi's. trail break was ok more glide on the downs but I'd have preferred a little more side cut for better turning....

so really, my initial thought was that the koms would be a fish scaled version of the hoks, and be the best of both worlds. wider shorted AND more side cut and glide. my bc tours could be a few miles, up to 10-12. and like I said I was hoping that the kom could be essentially a quiver of one- switching boots depending on the steepness. maybe it too much to ask. maybe replacing my 80s with sb 98s or 112s is more what I should be thinking

I am following you here-
If you are simply just looking for more "ski" than the Hok- then yes, I think that the Kom is a good choice.
And- yes- a 75mm-3pin binding will allow you to switch back and forth between a modern Telemark boot and a Nordic touring boot on the same ski (though the Kom is wide enough that you will need the Telemark boot to really drive this ski).

And- by extension, if you can get the S-Bound 125 at a super deal- then why not just get it and try it?

[Rickg707]

Hello again @Rickg707
I think your logic is spot on. If you want to ski leather boots, and want fish scales, your best choices are Sbound 88/112 or Panorama 68/78.
I think the option for an attachable kicker ski is a big deal.
Just curious, what leather boot?

I don't have leather boots, yet. I was going to get some if I got the skis with 3 pin bindings. if I go with the sb98s I'll stay with NNN BC. I have an extra set of them. I use Alpina Alaskas.

[Rickg707]

I am following you here-
If you are simply just looking for more "ski" than the Hok- then yes, I think that the Kom is a good choice.
And- yes- a 75mm-3pin binding will allow you to switch back and forth between a modern Telemark boot and a Nordic touring boot on the same ski (though the Kom is wide enough that you will need the Telemark boot to really drive this ski).

And- by extension, if you can get the S-Bound 125 at a super deal- then why not just get it and try it?
[/quote]

I wanted koms, then I saw the used SB125s. they were 165cm, almost the same length and dimensions as the Koms. but I didn't know if it was an apples to apples comparison. that's what prompted the initial question. the used SB125s were $400 for skis and bindings. a good deal, but still a good bit of cash. I read, and was advised by Altai, that the koms at 162 were right for me, but equally, It's been suggested here, and by the seller, that the 125s are a different ski and 165s far too short for me.

[Rickg707]

Yes @Rickg707 I agree with FE. I put a Voile 3 Pin Cable binding on my 98 and it is a great all-around backcountry ski. Heading out into unknown terrain looking for turns and some vertical this is the ski I'll grab. Pulling a toboggan into a cabin for a ski getaway? Slap a skin on it. Likey.

thanks wabene. is there a specific binding you recommend? I'm new to 3-pin and there are many voiles. by cable, do you mean the hard wire or the spring ones? lastly, for what you're describing are you in soft or hard boots? many thanks!

[wabene]

thanks wabene. is there a specific binding you recommend? I'm new to 3-pin and there are many voiles. by cable, do you mean the hard wire or the spring ones? lastly, for what you're describing are you in soft or hard boots? many thanks!

For about $80 you can get the Voile Mountaineer which is just plain pins. For $145 the Voile 3 Pin Cable binding which is the one with the springs. I put the Mountaineer on skis that are too cambered to turn like the TN66, but for the SB98 the 3PC is well worth the $65 extra. The Voile Hardwire is more powerful than the 3PC, but it is more expensive and much heavier. It comes with risers which add to the weight. The 3PC is a better match for leather boots. I'm still trying to break in my Scarpa T4'S, so I almost always use my Crispi Svartisens with the 98's. It's a great match. I'll keep the cables in my pack and ski the bare pins (which are a super lightweight binding) unless I'm doing laps for turns. Then the cable powers up the boot, binding combination. The 3PC is a super versatile binding for anything from soft leathers to stiff leathers to softer plastic boots like the T4 or Excursion (if you can find a pair). Keep in mind if you are going with these Voile bindings that they are designed for duckbills between 16mm & 20mm, so they work well with plastic boots and leather boots with thicker duckbills like Crispi boots, vintage leather Telemark boots and the Alico boots that Altai Skis is importing. The Alpina Alaska has a 15mm duckbill that works better with the Rottefella 3 pin bindings. I've only skied those bindings once so I don't have much of an opinion.

[lilcliffy]

I have touring skis with-
Voile 3-pin cable
Voile 3-pin hardwire
Rottefella 75mm with cable (ie supertelemark with "cable")

Although the manufacturing quality of the Voiles is superb-
I much prefer the 3-pin bale of the Rottefella- MUCH prefer.
IMO, the Rotte binding is best of the above for a leather touring boot.
I notice that Voile is making two different 3-pin bales (mountaineer; 201)- the "201" for thinner duckbills- I don't know if you can get the "201" with the cable?

[wabene]

The 201 does not come with the cable.

It is interesting that people who tend to prefer the Rotte ST are also people who tend to have thin duckbilled boots like the Alaska, just sayin.

[fisheater]

@wabene it doesn’t have anything to do with the Alaska. I did purchase my first Rotte Super Telemark with cable because of having an Alaska. I realized it is a better binding for leather boots. The clamp fits better. The biggest difference is the support the cable, which is actually a hardwire, gives the boot. I should say longitudinal support. Even a Voile Hardwire wouldn’t compare, for a leather boot.
After purchasing the Rotte ST with cable, I sold two pair of skis mounted Voile 3-pin cable, including the bindings. I knew I would never use them. That tells me everything

[wabene]

@wabene it doesn’t have anything to do with the Alaska. I did purchase my first Rotte Super Telemark with cable because of having an Alaska. I realized it is a better binding for leather boots. The clamp fits better. The biggest difference is the support the cable, which is actually a hardwire, gives the boot. I should say longitudinal support. Even a Voile Hardwire wouldn’t compare, for a leather boot.
After purchasing the Rotte ST with cable, I sold two pair of skis mounted Voile 3-pin cable, including the bindings. I knew I would never use them. That tells me everything

You have the Alaska. That is very pertinent. That is the common thread from where I sit. You got the Rotte cable which is a copy of the Voile Hardwire minus the risers, then preceded to mount the Rotte bindings on Voile risers. You then compare the performance of the Rotte cable to the Voile 3PC instead of the Voile Hardwire which would be the more appropriate comparison.
I'm sorry Fish, but you have stated here dozens of times as fact your opinion that the Rotte ST Cable binding is the best binding for leather boots. I'm mearly stating my opinion that the Voile bindings work well with boots that have robust duckbills. Voile clearly designed their binding to play well with plastic boots.
Let's face it these bindings, all of them are very, very simple mechanisms. We are splitting hairs anyway. If there is one decision by these companies that doesn't make sense to me, it's Alpina's decision to use a thin sole. They even had many problems with failure. You do not hear about that with Crispi or Alico boots. Both of those companies use what Altai is calling the Vibram Outback sole, the thicker sole. Smart choice. My Fisher BCX6 also had the Vibram Outback sole.