How Do I Turn?

[lowangle al]

I agree that people keep searching for the ski that is going to get them to the next level, when they should be trying to figure out the one the have. Just don't try with about the worst one possible. The Nansen is a good all around ski and a better choice to learn on. I would think that on the Gamme you would have to resort to snowplow turns more often.

I spent about 15 years on the same ski. Unfortunately it was the wrong one. One good thing about sticking with the same ski for many years is that it will soften up and ski better over time.

[fisheater]

I agree with Allen, you don’t cut door casing with a chain saw, and you are not pruning a tree with your power mitre box.
While I can make same nice turns on my Gamme, a lot of my Gamme turning is step turns, wedge turns, or stem christy telemarks.
What I do on my Gamme, is drop my knee on even little downhills. I may be going straight, but I drop a knee. Sometimes I drop a knee, the do a quick lead change and drop the other knee. My local hiking trails are twisty, and a lot of up in down. The woods are thick, the trails are the path. When I feel like patting myself on the back for making nice Telemark turns, I need the right conditions. A couple inches of soft snow over a consolidated base is prime time. In those conditions you will notice the rockered tip of Gamme is bowing up a bit. Well, it’s hard to bow a Gamme, but since I have that rocker bow, I roll that lead ski over on edge a bit. That lead ski will start turning. The trailing (back foot) ski I ski flat, no edging, and I rotate that ski with the turning lead ski. At some point in the turn, when the trailing ski is parallel with the lead ski I will drop more weight onto the trailing ski and feather the edge.
When I nail it I wish my dog was good with a video camera! The bottom line is I ski the Gamme the most. It’s a lot of fun to go fast on my up and down trails. It’s not a turner. I have an old E-99, it’s a slow ski. However it turns much easier.
I have wanted a Nansen for long time. It may be a long time more, because my Falketind Xplore kicks and glides good enough. It’s just hard to justify that ski that is between Gamme and FT X. So please don’t tell me how much fun Nansen is!

[Lhartley]

I agree that people keep searching for the ski that is going to get them to the next level, when they should be trying to figure out the one the have. Just don't try with about the worst one possible. The Nansen is a good all around ski and a better choice to learn on. I would think that on the Gamme you would have to resort to snowplow turns more often.

I spent about 15 years on the same ski. Unfortunately it was the wrong one. One good thing about sticking with the same ski for many years is that it will soften up and ski better over time.

That's interesting. I found a pair of beat up but "ok" dynafit cho oyos in an alley in Calgary. I had assumed they were discarded because they were skied out, but is that actually a benefit for learning? Hmm maybe I'll throw some bindings on them, I've read a few good reviews on that ski on this forum

[lowangle al]

Softer is better than stiffer for learning. They might not be a snappy as they once were, but you won't miss that at a beginner level.

[Musk Ox]

It’s just hard to justify that ski that is between Gamme and FT X. So please don’t tell me how much fun Nansen is!

You wouldn't like it.

[DG99]

Nice stuff. I will go back and read all this I promise lotsa stuff. For now let me add there are lots of ways to turn.

This reminds me of earlier style, using the front ski to stem and get it going around. Could think of it like a bike, turn the front wheel and the back follows around. People used to push the tip of their back ski into the turn with their front ski’s binding or boot.

[fisheater]

It’s just hard to justify that ski that is between Gamme and FT X. So please don’t tell me how much fun Nansen is!

You wouldn't like it.

Is Nansen a lot slower than Gamme? You could help me a lot by purchasing an FT X and providing a comparison between the two !

[Musk Ox]

It’s just hard to justify that ski that is between Gamme and FT X. So please don’t tell me how much fun Nansen is!

You wouldn't like it.

Is Nansen a lot slower than Gamme? You could help me a lot by purchasing an FT X and providing a comparison between the two !

I can confirm that Fridtjof is slower than Aleksander. But he is also less teal, so you win some you lose some.

Actually, to be really honest, I'm not the person to ask. Three or four years ago, we were overtaken on our MR48s on a pretty solid trail by an old guy on his old orange and yellow Nansens who was just cruising (not that we were speeding really, but he did leave us behind, he just disappeared). We got further up the hill and saw he'd left these gorgeous arcing tracks in the snow. He was having such a blast.

[tkarhu]

It’s just hard to justify that ski that is between Gamme and FT X. So please don’t tell me how much fun Nansen is!

You wouldn't like it.

Is Nansen a lot slower than Gamme? You could help me a lot by purchasing an FT X and providing a comparison between the two !

I guess you have seen this screenshot from Per-Erik Gamme’s video. It has been posted here earlier. However, the diagram on the photo shows speed vs turnability. In P-E Gamme’s experience, there seems to be more difference in speed than turnability between Nansen and Gamme.

In the diagram, up means turnable, down straight tracking, and left / right means slow / fast.

The video Gamme is ski designer Alexander ”Fabio” Gamme’s brother I guess, but might not favor his brother’s skis because he gave very critical review of the renewed Gamme, ie. its Fabio version. If I remember correctly, this is from an old video and green man Gamme time. Ingstad might be a different ski here than the current Ingstad, I do not know about Gamme and Nansen versions.

EDIT: Oh and size of red circle shows float.

[tkarhu]

DOUBLE CAMBER SKIS ARE THE MAJOR OBSTACLE IN MOVING FROM XC TO XCD. It can be done with a much larger commitment in time, energy, and risk of injury.

I do somewhat agree. On the other hand, good side of learning with Gammes is that you need to learn it right from the start. Yes it does take time and energy, but so does learning away bad habits.

It doesn't have to take 30 years to learn. With the right gear, good instruction and a season pass you could figure it out in a season.

For the risk of injury... A season pass sounds frightening! With double camber skis, a small kids' piste would be relevant at a downhill ski center. Maybe after learning more at bunny hills and in the backcountry where nobody is watching, I would feel comfortable at green or blue pistes among people.

For learning turns, Gammes are still a lot easier than most double camber skis. Gammes have 14 mm of sidecut and steel edges, which help a lot. Not to forget nordic rocker, that @fisheater mentioned.

But what you learn with Gammes, you can somewhat use with XC skis.



Video says there are three main XC competition downhill techniques:

• snowploughing

• skidded parallel turn

• step turn

The skidded parallel turn seems to use same tricks as a double camber telemark turn: pressuring and edging ski rear ends. In XC downhill with skate skis, I have started to do that. It is nicer to go downhill in a skate lane because there is always more snow than down in the tracks. If there is some crap in your way, you can go around it better without tracks. It just feels good to have more control with your skis, too. Before I started to learn telemark, I always just ran in tracks and hoped the best.

Sure Gammes are not a downhill ski for all conditions. I go downhill with them only in good conditions, and in easy places. When snow is hard or heavy, I go skate skiing, nordic ice skating, or classic skiing. Or stay indoors