Looking for Wax Selection Advice

[Stephen]

Lilcliffy, thanks for educating me about the dark side of Fluoro waxes. I would have otherwise ignored the dark shadows, and just assumed that since I could buy it, it must be okay.
I don’t want you to think I didn’t take your admonition seriously.

[Cannatonic]

>>Getting rid of the MH pants you already own won’t make the world a better place — they had to have not been made in the first place.

I'm not thinking of nature - my paranoia is focused on little particles getting into my bloodstream! Of course I hope using my dollars to buy sustainable products will help move companies in that direction. You could see how just 1 or 2 clothing companies switching to cruelty-free down forced most of the others to do it within a few years.

I'd like to use cast-iron cookware, if I was a better cook I would. Somewhat higher maintenance. Maybe I'll try one pan. I like Vollrath stainless steel which is US-made - I try to avoid Asian-made metals as much as possible.

[Stephen]

Right on. It can be challenging to lead a virtuous and righteous life.


Even cast iron can be a problem by getting too much iron that the body can’t eliminate well.
Maybe true ceramic (not the ceramic coated) is the way to go.

Ok, out of the kitchen and back to skis...

[CwmRaider]

Fluor based wax are no longer allowed in Norway for competition use, due to the hazard for nature, and for ski preppers. I have still seen it on sale (and ridiculously cheap) so it's not yet outright forbidden for recreational use.

[lilcliffy]

Lilcliffy, thanks for educating me about the dark side of Fluoro waxes. I would have otherwise ignored the dark shadows, and just assumed that since I could buy it, it must be okay.
I don’t want you to think I didn’t take your admonition seriously.

Hi Stephen,
Sorry I did not respond to you on this matter.
I am sorry if I gave you- or anyone- the impression that I was angry with you- I am certainly not.
I am just angry that we keep producing products like fluoro waxes.

I am all for disposable mass-produced products- as long as it turns into soil when you throw it out.

Take plastic-
The problem with plastic is not plastic- it is that we refuse to make plastic out of trees. (Which we can do- it just costs more to do it.)

Back to wax-
I hope I don't wake up one day and find out I am yet again a hypocrite-
My understanding is that only fluoro ski waxes are toxic-
But what about my beloved non-fluoro grip waxes? I really don't understand their chemical make-up...
I sure hope that my daily ski touring is not contributing to microplastic in the ocean...

Stephen-
Thank you so much or joining us and sharing your interest, passion and experience.
Gareth

[Stephen]

As long as you’re not throwing rocks at me, all good man.
I never had the impression you were angry at me, and I appreciated the education.
I dislike the impact man is having on the environment.
On the other hand, I drive a car, wear stuff not made from natural fibers, and on and on.

At least one problem I see with the Fluoro waxes is that, even if production was stopped today, what do we do with the tons of it that are in the supply chain? If one person doesn’t buy it, another will, or, it can go to land fill.
Can’t shoot the stuff into the center of the sun!

[Stephen]

I found a pretty good deal on Vauhti wax.
I have always used Swix, but am starting from scratch, so thought I might give Vauhti a try on a bulk order from Finland.
I know it would be harder to source individual items in the US, but not too worried about that.
To be honest, I switched from Swix because the site I was on was out of one of the items I wanted, and then it turned out the Vaughti was a little less expensive.
Oh, and because they are Finnish, and that seems cool!


Any thoughts on quality, effectiveness, usability, etc?
Any reason to not go that route?

[phoenix]

" Seems like fluoro has the biggest benefit around 0 F, or with higher humidity "

Flouro's come into their own on wet snow, or old and dirtier snow, in general. I've never tried Vaughti waxes, but they're probably just fine. You might find it takes a bit to get dialed in to their performance for a given color compared to the Swix.

[Stephen]

Phoenix, yeah, your’e confirming what I have been learning as I read up on different products.
On the learning curve, how hard can it be — the cans have the temp numbers printed on them!
Ha ha — but really, not rocket science.

Man, i gotta fix my image one of these days — I just look so... blah.

[Rainbow83]

Coming from the world of XC racing, it's a bit funny to me to come here and see people asking about fluoros. Ever since the EPA put a ban on Swix and Toko importing fluorinated waxes to the US a couple seasons ago, it's been a HUGE deal for the xc racing community. The EPA ban actually was more coincidental because they were really targeting companies using fluorocarbons for industrial purposes and Swix and Toko just happened to end up on that list of banned companies because of how much fluoros they import. The thing is, that also came at the same time as a lot of research about the lasting and harmful environmental effects of fluoros. Not only are they carcinogenic, they also get deposited on the snow and stay there throughout the year, affecting the local wildlife. FIS, which governs all international ski racing, Alpine and Nordic, banned them for the upcoming season last winter and NENSA, which is the governing body for xc racing in New England has also banned them, so it's a pretty big deal. I know the xcd and telemark community here probably doesn't care too much about the minutia of waxing in the world of xc racing, but it's been really interesting to watch it all unfold. If you're into high performance waxes, it's a very confusing and exciting time as all the big companies are now totally changing their wax lines.