Altai Kom skis

[fisheater]

Lots of speculating that can only be answered by biting bullets and trying and selling the failed ideas to fund new ones...

I can't agree more Woods. I think if I was just starting out I would keep the USGI, and buy an E-88. Then my decision would be whether to buy a Kom or a Vector/V-6. I still could use a skinny waxless, but I have not found one as inexpensive as I would like. My son is on an Alpina Discovery 68, I bought that cheap. I will need to stop by that shop sometime when I get in that area and see if I can get that in a 200-210. Gareth, you would appreciate the tip on that ski. I will not ski a skinny waxless often.

A ski that offers enough XC performance for significant distance...plus offers downhill performance as well...How are you finding those Combat USGIs for this context? It is truly a XC ski- but, if you are comfortable downhill skiing on it- that opens a whole world of possible options

I really like that USGI for trail skiing. I love it when blue wax works, they really fly (in my world) when the blue is working. I have not tried to ski the USGI's in powder. I have not had much, and the s-112 is a pretty good powder ski. If we had soft pow all the time, I wouldn't look for another downhill powder ski. It does leave something to be desired for touring when it gets much deeper than 8" to 10" or gets a little manky, or gets chopped up and re-frozen. I can turn the USGI on firm snow, mine are 200 cm as I originally was going to put my son on the second pair. I did have quite a bit of trouble handling the camber on 6"-8" of wet granular manmade on top of boiler plate at the resort. I do not have any spring corn, but I would like to see how I can handle corn. I did not handle the combination of slush and ice well at all. I have skied resort black diamond runs with the USGI on hard pack. You need to be aware of the camber, but the edge hold is better than the s-112. Even though the edge hold is better on the USGI, the s-112 is much easier to ski on that pitch.

A ski that offers enough XC performance for significant distance...plus offers downhill performance as well...

That is why I am still thinking about a V-6 / Vector waxable. I need to spend more time on my USGI wax skis. I found wax worked acceptably most of the time, but it was a second warm winter, and I do not have enough time on wax to drop the coin on an expensive waxable. I think I could sell a BC much easier if I didn't like it.. I think a Vector wax would tour better than the s-112 in deeper snow. I think it would handle crust much better, and to get the most downhill outings I need to be able to handle steep, tight, backcountry crust. I think the V-6 would handle crust better, but not tour as well in those crusty conditions. I accept Connyro's assertion that the V-6 tours well, but he has nice dry, cold, powder. I think it could be different in the warmer climate where I live.
As far as the steepness of my local hills. I look for downhills that would be steeper blue runs or blacks.
While kicker skins are really cool, I plan on experimenting with colltex (?) skins. I can't remember, I think Woods or Canna posted where you could purchase skins by the inch. I will do a search and bookmark the link. I am thinking I will probably buy a narrow skin for the USGI. I will cut it at the back of the heel.
For now I will just ski vicariously through the words and photos from where folks are still skiing. I'll be paddling the canoe soon. The trout opener is the end of the month, and I am looking forward to opening weekend trout camp.

[lilcliffy]

I really like that USGI for trail skiing. I love it when blue wax works, they really fly (in my world)

They really are an awesome distance-oriented BC-XCd ski- can't say enough good about them. And- I agree- they are fast- despite being heavy- that camber and flex, combined with that wicked tip is just made for crushing miles in the BC.

I have not tried to ski the USGI's in powder.

It sinks, doesn't "float"- but, the USGI is remarkably stable and effective in deep snow- it is MUCH better than the E-109 (and likely the T-78) in truly deep snow.

I think a Vector wax would tour better than the s-112 in deeper snow.

I'm sure you are right- wider, lower camber, rounder flex.

I think the V-6 would handle crust better, but not tour as well in those crusty conditions. I accept Connyro's assertion that the V-6 tours well, but he has nice dry, cold, powder. I think it could be different in the warmer climate where I live.

I would guess that V6 and the Vector- especially the V6- are likely useless in anything other than very deep snow, if there is any significant distance involved...

As far as the steepness of my local hills. I look for downhills that would be steeper blue runs or blacks.

Then E-88 over T-78.

While kicker skins are really cool, I plan on experimenting with colltex (?) skins. I can't remember, I think Woods or Canna posted where you could purchase skins by the inch. I will do a search and bookmark the link. I am thinking I will probably buy a narrow skin for the USGI. I will cut it at the back of the heel.

You gonna cut a notch in the tip and use that pop botttle trick and make your own home-made skimo racing skins?

For now I will just ski vicariously through the words and photos from where folks are still skiing. I'll be paddling the canoe soon. The trout opener is the end of the month, and I am looking forward to opening weekend trout camp.

It is finally raining here this evening- a true spring rain. Still have over a metre of base in the hills here, but the end is in sight- my hogs can almost smell fresh earth...

[Woodserson]

I took the KOMs yesterday up to Mount Washington and I skied the east snowfields. I'm not sure how steep they are, many people say 30deg, I guess that's close. I know that they slide from time to time, so they are at least probably 25deg. People love to exaggerated slope angles (dude! it was like 75degrees!) so I tend to underestimate mine. Regardless, steeper and fun but nothing crazy. This is the steepest terrain I had the KOMs on so far and the snow was corn with a few hardspots underneath.

The biggest thing I noticed is that when you drop the knee due to their shortness and forward mount is that it's much easier to get the tip caught under the other boot and binding. Also, I got in the backseat once or twice and the tail is so wide it really loaded up and then shot me out of the turn. Once I kept a figurative eye on the ski tip and made sure to stay forward they skied fine, and were much fun! I'm glad I practiced on something a little lower angle on these fields before bringing them into something steeper like the Ravine but I wonder if it would be better to stay out of the super-steep stuff with the KOMs at least at my ability level. I could have, of course, just paralleled, but where the fun in that?

Slipped on hard stuff at :13 sec and caught the tip at :22 sec.... nice save!

[lilcliffy]

Great video and useful tips man- thanks for posting!

[lilcliffy]

So- I am now the very excited owner of a set of 162cm Koms!!!!

Initially impressions:
1) I am surprised and pleased that they have a true traditional single camber.

2) They have a smooth round flex to them- but again I am pleasantly surprised by their stiffness. They have have a significantly stiffer flex than my old Guides (that they are replacing).

3) They have gorgeous elongated raised trail-breaking tips, that are slightly rockered.

4) They truly do have "early taper" and are quite straight through the meat of the ski- with a wonderful whopping 98mm underfoot.

Anyone skied these on dense/hard/groomed snow? They give me at least the impression that they should have decent edge hold...

I debated long and hard about getting the 174cm...In the end I think that the 162cm is the best choice- the local BC slopes I want to ski are steep and forested.

SO- DECISIONS!!!!

Voile 3-pin-cable?

OR-

Voile Switchback?

[Lo-Fi]

So- I am now the very excited owner of a set of 162cm Koms

Anyone skied these on dense/hard/groomed snow? They give me at least the impression that they should have decent edge hold...

I debated long and hard about getting the 174cm...In the end I think that the 162cm is the best choice- the local BC slopes I want to ski are steep and forested.

SO- DECISIONS!!!!

Voile 3-pin-cable?

OR-

Voile Switchback?

Congratulations on your Koms! I’ve had a lot of fun with them over last season. I came from the Guides too.

Edge hold is decent for a wide ski. Probably the moderate side-cut helps edging and the short 162cm makes them easy to throw around. In soft snow, I find they plane and pivot really nicely.

My video posted on page 8 of this thread was my first skiing on the Koms, on the last of the spring snow coverage, so the snow was totally transformed, refrozen, granular and hard.

As to which binding to choose, I received the skis with the Altai 3-pin cable (like the Voile), which seem to be versatile and a good value. However, for my skiing, I didn’t like just the three pins for such a substantial ski and I found the spring cable, even at minimal tension, limited heel-lift for touring too much.

I am skiing them now with the original Voile non-3-pin Hardwires at minimum tension:




Super easy to get in and out of, enough range of motion for kick and glide(aka shuffling) and good support for turning.



.

[Woodserson]

So I have the Voile 3pin cable on mine with the traverse riser plate, and they have been stupendous for most applications. 3 pins to get me up the hill, cable for the down, I've been over the moon. However, I found that on hard spring snow approaching 30deg I wanted for more tension. However, I don't see this very often with the KOMS so I'm going to leave it as is. If I score a second pair, I will put Voile Hardwires on them for more tension but still ease of 3 pin touring and maybe move the mount 1cm back to help with not catching the tips on the binding. I would not do this for my original KOM however, the mounting spot is perfect for 95% of my skiing.

Re-read and watch the video of the east snowfields two posts up for a demo of this.

The Switchbacks are overkill but personally I don't like the free-pivot action for K&G, I prefer the pin action/feel. YMMV, etc.

Voile 3pincable or Traverse or Hardwires. That's my rec.

DOOOOOOOOOD you're going to love this skiiii!

[lilcliffy]

I have never tried free-pivot bindings in a Telemark/Nordic binding- only AT.

I certainly want some binding resistance when XC skiing...BUT- that is not what I want this ski for...

I will be skiing up to a few miles into steep forested ravines and hardwood slopes- then doing yo-yo laps with them.

The switchback primarily interests me for the efficiency of the steep free-pivot climbing...

And- I don't see myself truly XC skiing on this ski- more of a shuffling along...

And- others report shuffling along in free-pivot mode- in deep soft snow- on a single-cambered downhill ski- to work fine...

The main turn off of the switchback is the extra weight...AND- I would like to try the Kom with a leather 3-pin boot on more moderate terrain...I have also never used a riser plate on a BC Nordic ski...

Spoke to Nils recently about the riser plate- he prefers no riser plate for BC snow...

The 3-pin traverse riser plate has a backslope to it, doesn't it?

[lilcliffy]

As to which binding to choose, I received the skis with the Altai 3-pin cable (like the Voile), which seem to be versatile and a good value. However, for my skiing, I didn’t like just the three pins for such a substantial ski and I found the spring cable, even at minimal tension, limited heel-lift for touring too much.

Did you find the 3-pin-cable enough lateral support for this ski?

Did you notice a big difference in support and leverage with the hardwire vs. the 3pc?

I would release the cable when climbing and XC skiing...

I would be using primarily my T4s with this ski.

Do you think the T4 is enough of a boot to truly take advantage of the hardwires?

I would hate to fork out the extra do for the hardwires/switchbacks just to find I need more boot to truly benefit from what they have to offer...

The 3-pin-cable is really the only Telemark binding that I have a lot of experience with- I have merely tested more supportive/active Telemark bindings and boots.

[Woodserson]

I have never tried free-pivot bindings in a Telemark/Nordic binding- only AT.

I certainly want some binding resistance when XC skiing...BUT- that is not what I want this ski for...

I will be skiing up to a few miles into steep forested ravines and hardwood slopes- then doing yo-yo laps with them.

The switchback primarily interests me for the efficiency of the steep free-pivot climbing...

In my opinion, and how I like to move, and what I've done in the past, miles of flat on a free-pivot drives me batty. Great for climbing steeps. Annoying on flats, compared to pins. I know this can be contentious, but it's my preference. Even "shuffling along."

The main turn off of the switchback is the extra weight...AND- I would like to try the Kom with a leather 3-pin boot on more moderate terrain...I have also never used a riser plate on a BC Nordic ski...

Spoke to Nils recently about the riser plate- he prefers no riser plate for BC snow...

The 3-pin traverse riser plate has a backslope to it, doesn't it?

I got the traverse plate because I used to rise my alpine bindings high, and my Fritschi's were high, and I liked that feeling. I also knew I was going to take the KOMs to Mt. Washington, and I wanted some extra leverage and clearance. There is a slight backslope to them, yes. I am totally ok flat-mounting the 3pincable or Hardwire to the KOM. This was just a personal decision to add lift.

Nils told me he rarely T-Turns on his KOMs, he parallels. FYI. I mostly Tele on them. Also, he talked me into the 162cm and I have no regrets.