Altai Kom skis

[lilcliffy]

Why the 3-pin-cable versus the hardwire or even the switchback?

[lowangle al]

I don't know about the Kom but you can get the Vector with a waxable base.

You MWV guys ever ski the Auto road? I did it 30 years ago and it was a pretty easy way to get to the summit.

[lilcliffy]

No waxable Kom- sucky.

IF I end up going as wide as the Kom- I will have a VERY hard time deciding between the Vector and the Kom...

[Woodserson]

I think I might have to have the Kom...

At this point- how would you compare the Kom to the Vector?

Why the 3-pin-cable versus the hardwire or even the switchback?

I don't know. I have 180cm Waxable Vectors and they are an amazing ski but I'm still struggling with them. I get bucked off and am still peddling the idea of selling them and going for 170cm Vectors for what I'm doing. I am not the authority on Vectors in this forum, (except that I can say they are amazing skis).

The Koms are a completely different ski. The Vectors are a stupendously well designed rocker alpine ski that is light, somewhat stiff, precise. The Koms are definitely a XCD ski with big tip and big rocker and a fat tail. I would do a long tour on Vectors in big mountains and a pack. I would use the Kom's for my backyard and local areas and steep small shots and fun stuff like the Cog Railway.

Today I skied at a small local rope-tow and the snow was yesterday's wet snow heated to 45deg. Sloooooow and thick. I was on my Boundless and then swapped to the Koms and they just charged through the stuff like it was nothing. The scaled broke up the water tension too and they slid a bit better. They are an awesome, fun ski for things like this.

My binding choice was decided by what spare parts I had laying around. I know Lo-Fi has old-school pinless Hardwires on his. Altai recommends their branded Voile 3pin with cable and says it's sufficient. I just added the riser because I like rise. They seem to work. I think Hardwires would also be effective and are a contender if I start going into the Ravines with the Koms and want the lateral stiffness. I think SB's would be overkill.

[Woodserson]

You MWV guys ever ski the Auto road? I did it 30 years ago and it was a pretty easy way to get to the summit.

The Auto Road is somewhat under the jurisdiction of Great Glen Trails, a XC Touring company based at the bottom of the Auto Rd. For skiing on the Road you now technically need a ticket from Great Glen EXCEPT for the portion between the Old Jackson Road and Connie's Way so a skier can close the loop from Pinkham Notch/Joe Dodge.

[Woodserson]

No waxable Kom- sucky.

IF I end up going as wide as the Kom- I will have a VERY hard time deciding between the Vector and the Kom...

They are low camber. Grip wax would be a nightmare and so would using skins for quick up and downs. They are designed to be a scaled ski. If you want a waxed ski, I would definitely recommend the Vectors. If you want something for quick up and down, I would get the Koms or the Vector BC (w/ scales).

After some though I will say the biggest difference between my Koms and Vectors is that the Koms turn 5 times in the Vectors 1 turn at low speeds, with my experience level (and 162 vs 180). The Vectors are incredibly turney but the Koms just turn at no speed. I was sliding off a parking lot to climb up the Cog and was able to turn around a tree creeping along at a snails pace. Awesome!

[lilcliffy]

I think SB's would be overkill.

(I happen to have a set of new 3-pin-cables sitting on my shelf...)

Why do you think the SBs would be overkill?

Did you lean towards 3-pin bindings so you might remove the cable on a more mellow tour, or with softer leather/composite boots?

The reason I am leaning towards a 3-pin binding is that if I buy the Kom, it will likely finally replace the Guide/Annum as my "powder" Nordic touring ski- and if I am going to do a distance-oriented XCD tour in deep pow, I would like to use a softer boot than the T4 (e.g. my Ski March).

Although I am very attracted to the free-pivot climbing and downhill performance of the SB- I don't know how much I would like the SB with a soft leather boot...Connyro has convinced me that the SB is just fine for K&G with a plastic boot- not so sure about leather...

ALSO- my only experience with the advantages of free-pivot are extended climbs up extreme slopes- using full-length climbing skins...

Almost 100% of the climbing I will be doing with the Kom would be low-vert- I will rarely be climbing anything high enough to warrant the performance free-pivot.

Therefore, the main advantage of the SB would be downhill performance...

I think that I may have just talked myself into the 3-pin hardwire...

[lilcliffy]

DAMN...

Except that the "tour" free-pivot mode of the completely frees the heel- allowing K&G without releasing the cable...

Woods- what are you doing with the cable when climbing and doing yo-yo laps?

[lowangle al]

LC I don't think the lack of a free pivot will be a big deal with the T4 although it is more efficient eliminating forward resistance and downward tip pressure. I rarely use free pivot because most of my climbing involves sidestepping and herringboneing and it doesn't work for that. It also makes it harder to compress your bellows and takes a little more thought and effort.

When I'm touring with HWs I either clip them to the heel piece or remove them. In order to easily remove them I had to switch the hooks around, inserting them from the bottom up as apposed to top down. You need to be carefull if you do this as they can fall off during transport. One problem in deep wet snow with the heel throws clipped to the heel piece is more snow building up under your boot than you would have otherwise.

Once I start doing laps I rarely remove the heel throws from my boot but that's because I'm lazy and most of my climbs are short(less than 10 minutes)

[Woodserson]

I think SB's would be overkill.

(I happen to have a set of new 3-pin-cables sitting on my shelf...)

Why do you think the SBs would be overkill?

Did you lean towards 3-pin bindings so you might remove the cable on a more mellow tour, or with softer leather/composite boots?

The reason I am leaning towards a 3-pin binding is that if I buy the Kom, it will likely finally replace the Guide/Annum as my "powder" Nordic touring ski- and if I am going to do a distance-oriented XCD tour in deep pow, I would like to use a softer boot than the T4 (e.g. my Ski March).

Therefore, the main advantage of the SB would be downhill performance...

I think that I may have just talked myself into the 3-pin hardwire...

I had the Voile 3pin hanging around and Nils and Francois use 3pin Cables on theirs. Good enough for them, good enough for me. I don't mind climbing with HW's/3 Pins since you don't need the cables/rods. I tuck them behind the heel and they sit there all day nice and happy.

I am unimpressed K&G ON FLATS with Koms and 3pin AND T4s, but that is because I am so used to leathers for the K&G. As soon as we start to climb and it's all K and no G, no problems. I think if I had a heavier set-up or a needed a burly boot that didn't provide for pins, then SB would be awesome. But they are $$$ and I got my 3pins CHEAP.

(FWIW I also find the 3pin/HW to be more active than the straight SB and the SBX2 to be the most active out of the three... another reason I gravitate to the 3pin/HW instead of the SBX2 which is a serious binding)

I am not sure however, if the Koms are going to be a good replacement for the Annums, I seriously think I would replace a 112 or Annum that I was using for touring with an Objective if I was looking to change up the ski. My Koms are for strict UP and DOWN, tight tree shots, tight steeps, and local skiing. If I'm looking at rolling terrain and many miles, I'd want something else. This is an opinion that may change, we will see.

LC I don't think the lack of a free pivot will be a big deal with the T4 although it is more efficient eliminating forward resistance and downward tip pressure. I rarely use free pivot because most of my climbing involves sidestepping and herringboneing and it doesn't work for that. It also makes it harder to compress your bellows and takes a little more thought and effort.

When I'm touring with HWs I either clip them to the heel piece or remove them. In order to easily remove them I had to switch the hooks around, inserting them from the bottom up as apposed to top down. You need to be carefull if you do this as they can fall off during transport. One problem in deep wet snow with the heel throws clipped to the heel piece is more snow building up under your boot than you would have otherwise.

Once I start doing laps I rarely remove the heel throws from my boot but that's because I'm lazy and most of my climbs are short(less than 10 minutes)

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