The NNN/BC Truth Thread

[Teleman]

Wow connie.....such hate.....Man you need a ski....."All men are created equal".....That is a religious icon for me and for many other Americans.....Even before YOUR creator connie that is a truth.....Individuals within that concept can be "good or bad".....But the concept that all are CREATED equal is a concept perhaps foreign to you?....have a good day connie, you deserve one....TM

[connyro]

Wow connie.....such hate.....Man you need a ski....."All men are created equal".....That is a religious icon for me and for many other Americans.....Even before YOUR creator connie that is a truth.....Individuals within that concept can be "good or bad".....But the concept that all are CREATED equal is a concept perhaps foreign to you?....have a good day connie, you deserve one....TM

Hey dopey, I would be more than happy to post a link to some of your more choice racist and bigoted rants from the 'other' forum, but out of respect for this forum, I'll refrain, unless you want me to dig up some of those gems for you...and everyone else to admire.

It looks like I'll continue to ski fresh powder for at least another week. How about you? Smoking ciggys and shooting your mouth off does NOT count.

[MikeK]

Wow connie.....such hate.....Man you need a ski....."All men are created equal".....That is a religious icon for me and for many other Americans.....Even before YOUR creator connie that is a truth.....Individuals within that concept can be "good or bad".....But the concept that all are CREATED equal is a concept perhaps foreign to you?....have a good day connie, you deserve one....TM

Hey dopey, I would be more than happy to post a link to some of your more choice racist and bigoted rants from the 'other' forum, but out of respect for this forum, I'll refrain, unless you want me to dig up some of those gems for you...and everyone else to admire.

It looks like I'll continue to ski fresh powder for at least another week. How about you? Smoking ciggys and shooting your mouth off does NOT count.

Ahh... perfect example... Thank you boys.

As a moderator I should perhaps discipline connyro for instigating Teleman a post back. But I won't. There was a time when I would have intervened and backed up the old guy but a couple things:

1 - I'm human and I have inherent bias no matter how impartial I'm supposed to be. Teleman has burned me a few times so I'm inclined to turn my head. I also like connyro better. He actually posts useful ski information and isn't as close minded as Teleman. He's offered to help me out in certain situations with equipment, advice, ect... still... should I be biased? No.

2 - The real reason is this: Teleman has made many claims which he cannot back up. Most rely on how loud he can shout at someone and not any actual useful rhetoric. Therefore claiming he is a bigot probably holds a lot more credibility than him saying otherwise. There is probably proof of this. Maybe he was joking, maybe not? At any rate he's lost my credibility in backing him up on anything. He fights his own battles as far as I'm concerned and I want nothing to do with him.

There was a time when the tables were turned as I said, but time and experience have changed my views. If you want to take sides, go for it. I'd say stick with those have some integrity and an open mind, it will probably work out for you better in the end.

[1EyedJack]

HOLY CRAP!



ya know, rather than mental thumb wrestling, there are other ways to ease the stress and strain of a not getting the goods this winter. things that come to mind are sex, drugs, rock&roll..... back away from the idiot box (and people used to think television was the idiot box ), shovel dogshit, mow the lawn, join a cult, eat a peach

[video][/video]

peas.

[Teleman]

Ha, you guys crack me up....Hypocrites anybody?.....Mike you and your lap dog crowslime get exactly what you deserve...Your disintegration is pictures on Ron's site.....Ron is at least honest in what he says.....I may not agree but he is brutally honest.....Like it or not Mikie...we can ski.....and all your insults will....can not change that fact....Why don't you and slimebag put on a demo....Put up the pictures.....Jealousy is a sad thing and both of you deserve each other....Arc on boys....if you can....snicker.....TM

[MikeK]

Allman Bros... nice. Some music vid drift I can get behind

Peace, love, leather, skinnies, pins, and NNN - I have them all. Do you?


On a side note I remember getting stoned with friends back in high school and they all wanted to listen to Biggie and Wu Tang and I would put on Eat a Peach or Brothers and Sisters. I think it was Blue Sky that one of my friends called his 'happy' song. He described it as floating away on a big puffy cloud over amber fields of wheat.

[Teleman]

Once had a run in with the guy who wrote the book on Telemark.....(for all aspiring telemark PSIA instructors)....We went at it and lots of people took sides....The dust settled, we shook hands had a few laughs and went on our ways....I like talking telemark, getting into spats about insults perceived, real or not, not so much....Continue with the NNN....I'll go to the Telemark thread and continue with whatever it is that is....Carry on boys and if you get the chance arc one for me....Hiked Little Mountain this morning with my wife....Leaned on my trusty walking stick and was blown away by Mount Mansfield and the white ribbons running down....A giant sea of Hardwood ridges and the Worcester Mountain range all contributed to peace love Maple Syrup and skiing....TM

[connyro]

Allman Bros... nice. Some music vid drift I can get behind

Great, now I've got Blue Sky in my head. Allman Bros was one of my favorite shows. Saw them at Pine Knob MI - an old garbage dump that they shoved into the large man-made ski hill. Never skied there, but sure have seen some good shows there.

[lowangle al]

Great, now I've got Blue Sky in my head. Allman Bros was one of my favorite shows

Same thing I thought, probably the best show I ever been to.

[lilcliffy]

http://thingstolucat.com/ski-touring-equipment-guide/

Interesting perspective that bgregoire perhaps touched on (off-topic) in another thread. I wasn't at all focused on this aspect, but more the fact that the current options seem to IMO provide adequate turning ability for light skis.

This is perhaps more interesting, if true. I'm not doing long trips with this type of equipment and I get the feeling not a lot of others are either, so I'd guess that statement about the market being shifted by weekend day trippers to be true. This happens in a lot of markets.

Thing is, I don't notice any of what the author claims at all. I've never had one bit of ice in these bindings and used them in all sorts of temps. Never overnight though. Perhaps that is where the problem lies? Also I don't take my skis off unless I absolutely have to, so my perspective is severely limited. The only thing I know is that sometimes the mech box gets jammed up with snow and won't close fully. I have the same issue with pins sometimes where the plate gets wadded up with snow and I can't get my pins to align or the bale to close. Either require some minor cleaning to get 100% functional again.

I also don't know of ANY boot failures. I don't have as many miles on my boots as some but I see no sign of wear, have no worries about the sole or the toe bar failing. Both seem very well built and solid. I put as much, or more load on it doing some bushwhack XCD than anyone would on a long tour. I can't see a failure happening during the actual K+G operation. I'd guess it's a torquing/twisting type issue.

The only failure that even slightly concerns me with this binding is snapping the sliding hooks jamming the mech closed with some in-compressible snow/ice in there. I believe that is how bgregoire said his failed. I could see any of those mech parts being overstressed in that situation.

So anyway, is this article bull, or is there some evidence to show this is still a thing? Obviously, for most of us, it doesn't appear to be a concern because we're just day trippers. But with regular skiing, day trippers can still rack up the miles.

I read this post as well a few weeks ago. I am not sure under what conditions that people are using NNNBC tech for long distance touring, where there have been consistent failures in the boot and binding.

In order for the binding to freeze up there would have to be a lot of water getting into the binding mechanism...

I can personally say that in all the thousands of backcountry miles I have skied on NNNBC- I have never had a toe-bar pull out.

There seems to be this misconception that NNNBC is a free-pivot binding, and that the only connection between the boot and the binding is the toe bar- this is not true. The boot is at least partially engaged with the binding rails all the time- especially in the backcountry- and especially in a downhill context.

NNNBC tech has consistently been used in the longest distance tours, in the harshest environments on Earth.

I would think that if they are having that much trouble with NNNBC- it must be because of a very specific context that involves a lot of water- that freezes when the temperature drops.

The issue of having cold wet feet has nothing to do with the binding- but everything to do with the advantages of a boot with a removable liner that can be dried out. I find that the “waterproof” composite/synthetic Nordic boots are particularly prone to wet, cold feet- because they do not breathe, and it takes at least a full day to properly dry them out. Breathable materials are critical when it comes to a simple boot on a multi-day tour (and an oil-based leather treatment is going to destroy the waterproof-breathable properties of a synthetic inner liner).

There seems to be a real love to hate NNNBC. And the notion that there is some sort of marketing conspiracy that has led to the success of NNNBC seems a bit much to me.

NNNBC is successful because it works. It is not successful because it is designed for casual weekend “off-track cruisers”. It is successful because it has been put to the test by avid, committed Nordic skiers in Fennoscandia- and it has passed the test.

NNNBC (like NNN) is a xcountry binding technology. And in xcountry context it outperforms NN. If it didn’t we’d still be racing on NN.

Somebody somewhere, at some point, suggested that NNNBC was designed to be a downhill (i.e. "Telemark") binding and replace 75mm- despite the fact that Rottefella has never made this claim. As a result of this claim, certain people have been shitting on NNNBC ever since (including myself for many, many years- I wouldn’t even try it, not that long ago).

NNNBC is a well-designed, rugged, reliable, stable, high-performance xcountry binding- designed for the backcountry.

Even the sole-flex design of NNNBC boots is optimized for xcountry striding in the backcountry.

Can you downhill ski on NNNBC? Sure you can- but the lack of boot power in most NNNBC boots requires the appropriate technique.

The inherent advantage of 75mm is its versatility- ranging from xcountry, to downhill Telemark.

Comparing the power of a 75mm Telemark setup to a BC-XC NNNBC setup doesn’t make much sense to me.

But for many of us that want a true balance between xcountry and downhill performance (i.e. are unwilling to sacrifice xcountry performance for downhill power), and are not skiing on extreme terrain- NNNBC is all we need.

The majority of backcountry Nordic skiers that are using NNNBC, aren’t using it because they have been successfully duped by marketing- they are using it because it is perfectly designed for the context they are skiing in.

NNNBC was designed and developed for XCD- not pure downhill.