Plea to Americans!!!

[acrowe]

I am always pleased when I see anyone else out human powered, good skier or bad, snowshoer or even the occasional hiker, as almost everyone is on a snow machine here. I am the only one around town with a fat bike so if a bike messed up the trail it was probably me (I make a big effort not to mess them up). I guess that's what happens when you live in the middle of nowhere

[MikeK]

Yeah, that's actually more of an issue in the North Country. Snow machines become quite excessive.

So I guess I really don't get the town boards and how they decide this stuff. I mean why is it OK to ban bicycles but allow morons to walk on snow covered trails and post hole them. I just read this from our local bike trail crew:

Corbett’s Glen Park Update
Following the email correspondence from the Town of Brighton Superintendent of Parks Tim Beeman on Jan 17th, GROC was informed that the Town would be officially closing its park to bicycles citing excessive trail damage due to bikes and pedestrian safety issues. After complying with the Towns request to inform our membership of the closure, GROC representatives requested a meeting with Town officials to address the concerns stated.

On Jan. 28th, GROC representatives Jeff Wright, Adam Reitz, and Mark Rosenzweig, met with the Town’s Commissioner of Public Works and the Superintendent of Parks. There were a variety of issues discussed, but the majority of the conversation focused on several key areas:

The Town has a 1996 ordinance that states bikes are not allowed in any Brighton Town Parks, unless otherwise authorized.
It was GROC’s understanding that Corbett’s Glen Park was open to cyclists due to certain language that was written in the Town’s 2004 Master Plan document that refers to the trails as “multi-use,” even though the plan does not specifically cite cycling as a permissible activity.
The Town’s current administration does not interpret multi-use as inclusive of cycling.
Any excessive trail damage was not caused solely by cyclists, but by all users as a result of poor trail design, water, and excessive trail use when conditions were delicate.
In exchange for inclusive access, GROC would be willing to support Corbett’s Glen Park by offering to help educate users on proper trail use and contribute to trail work projects.
GROC as an organization has contributed over ten thousand hours of volunteer trail work to the 4 parks it has created shared use trails in, equating to over three hundred thousand dollars of value added to those parks. As a respected organization in the community, representing a growing user group, we wish to be included in plans for future park development and when park master plans are up for review.
On Friday Jan 29th the Town of Brighton followed up on the meeting with an email stating that they decided to move forward with officially closing the park to bikes and asked that GROC continue to spread the word of it’s closure. Park personnel will be posting signs at some point in the near future informing park users.

We are disappointed that the Town of Brighton has chosen to exclude cyclists from Corbett’s Glen, but this advocacy effort has brought awareness to Park and Town officials, not only regarding our organization, but the off-road cycling community in general. If you are a Brighton resident and are unhappy with this decision, we would encourage you to contact Town officials to express your disappointment with their multi-use policy, and to advocate for a more inclusive shared-use policy.

GROC Board

Blah blah blah... so we pay taxes but we can't ride our bikes there, even if we are willing to build better trails.

[fisheater]

My favorite local trails are on State land. We have became more suburban than the semi rural area it was 30 years ago. Last year it was the snowmobiles that trashed the trails when we had a warm up. We also have hikers, fat tire bikes and horses. Several years ago the horse people tried banning the mountain bikes and it backfired on them. An active mountain bike association ended up having equestrian use confined to a smaller area reflecting the amount of actual equestrian users. I figure I will not complain about the stink sledders, there are more of them. The few skiers I see generally avoid my favorite trails.
Btw if you find yourself in my neck of the woods in bike season the mtb trails are excellent. As long as you can carry lots of speed up and down the hills. If not you are in for a workout. Early season I still get my butt kicked, even I had a good ski season.

[MikeK]

I wrote a strongly worded letter to the parks department. I plan on visiting them too. And attending meetings if they have public hearings. They won't hear the last of me!

I'll probably need to go beat the streets and sign petitions.

[Woodserson]

Several years ago the horse people tried banning the mountain bikes and it backfired on them. An active mountain bike association ended up having equestrian use confined to a smaller area reflecting the amount of actual equestrian users. I figure I will not complain about the stink sledders, there are more of them.

This is why education across user-groups is something that might be contemplated first, before going to the authorities for bans. There is often plenty of space to all play as long as people want to work together. I often XC on the local snowmobile trails, and I get out of the way when I hear them coming, give a friendly wave. Usually, they wave back, no one has ever antagonized me. I need their massive amounts of powers of persuasion so I can continue to access lands that would otherwise be closed entirely.

[Teleman]

With ya Mike.....I set and or the boys set a beautiful skinny track miles into the forest or up some dynamite hill with awesome telemark reality....But the stinkin ATers on skis twice as wide as mine double the track and the downhill side falls off so ya go up on a dual track that has a high side and a low side....Stinkin ban em....Ditto for snowboarders post holing....and stinkin faaaat tele rigs.....and ANYBODY who isn't like ME!!!!!!! All that land is for me and I will get the boards to do as I please....Skrew everybody else....Teleman

[lowangle al]

Tman you didn't even mention that those jerks on the fat skis wouldn't even know where to go if they didn't see your tracks in the first place. And when they get to the goods they track it up and pack it down twice as fast. They shouldn't allow skis with a waiste wider than about 110mm and postholers should be beaten with ski poles.

[MikeK]

Post holers should get 50 lashings with a wet noodle!

Fat skis greater than 110mm should have their skins and wax taken away for week and have to sidestep everything.

[lowangle al]

Post holers should get 50 lashings with a wet noodle!

Fat skis greater than 110mm should have their skins and wax taken away for week and have to sidestep everything.

I think you mean "Mountain Noodle" an old tele ski by Yostmark I think. It soft enough that it won't killem on the first wack.

I was out on Saturday with 108mm waiste ski WITH kick wax and did my share of sidestepping and herringbone. Haven't used skins in a few years and getting more turns because of it.

[STG]

Mike:

I posted a rant but it didn't appear. I will do another post because this issue of ski etiquette is important. Like connyro, I try to seek out quiet, untracked BC terrain. However, if you have to ski in an urban environment, it is hard to avoid the culture of narcissism. It seems like so many users of public land/places are clueless about etiquette and resource damage. Contacting the board or writing a letter would be effective. Like teleman, I have had my tracks destroyed by snowshoers and fat boarders. After 30 years of BC skiing and having to deal with these people, I am really pissed off. When possible, I try to inform the person that is destroying the trail and impacting my experience. Some people get defensive but others are willing to listen and are often unaware of ski etiquette. I am careful with words and tone when I talk to these people because I really want them understand my perspective.