Telemark Talk / Telemark Tips Forum

Hi, this is my first post.
I've been telemark skiing (Badly) since about 2007.
I was hitting it pretty hard for a couple of years then sort of fell off the bandwagon.
I'm back and I am trying to get better at tele turning, so here goes.
My gear:
Garmont Ener-G's custom fit for me.
22 designs hammerheads I run either the 3rd or 4th hole back.
PMGear Bro 179's soft flex .

Here is what I am doing:
On greens and blues, I can tele-turn and lead change pretty strongly left to right, but right to left I hesitate before dropping the right knee (it might be the other way around, but there is a hesitation going from one direction to the other.

-Not sure how to fix this.

I know I am not weighting the back leg enough in the turn and mostly weighting the downhill 'forward' ski.

-On green runs I have been doing mono-mark turns, this might help with the first issue.

I think I am skiing in the back seat. The reason I know this is that I am not feeling the tongues of my boots when I turn. when I lean into the tongues, I feel like (and eventually) face plant.

I have been doing telebirds and can spin around and start skiing backwards, but when I try to lead change to turn back around I butt-plant.

-James

Paging Johnny, aisle 3... Johnny, aisle 3...

Sounds like some questions for a certified Tele instructor

I can't offer you much on your technique but I will ask this...

Have you sought out personal instruction? I'm almost certain a good teacher could point out what you are doing wrong easier than someone on the internet.

I know not all instructors are great - most are great skiers, not all are great teachers... but I'd get right at that and not mess around. If someone can show you some new drills or point out your flaws it will be worth the money you spend struggling.

And maybe some of it is just getting comfortable and practicing. Je te dis merde!

MikeK wrote: Have you sought out personal instruction? I'm almost certain a good teacher could point out what you are doing wrong easier than someone on the internet.

I'd like to get some private one on one instruction, but I am operating on a shoestring budget right now. There is only 1 resort that seems to offer Tele lessons and they aren't the resort that my pass is at. Compound that with the lessons being 100 per hour and I figure I'd need 3-4 hours worth of lessons.

I have a friend from the ice coast that teles so I might be able to get him to go with me and help me out.

-James

tiger, I'll try and hit a couple of your points, but will let others chime in as well.

Tongue pressure: learning to pressure your cuffs properly will likely help with a lot of your issues. First, don't think of it as leaning into your tongues, that's kind of a cheater technique for alpine, and with a free heel just won't work well - and you'll just fall on your face as you've found. Focus more on flexing at your ankles/driving your knees forward to achieve the cuff pressure and driving that pressure down into the ski (the old 'push the bush' will help with this as well - in that keeping your hips forward/driving down the hill tends to get you into that cuff pressure stance). You shouldn't ever be so spread out (on purpose) in a tele turn that you can't keep cuff pressure on your downhill/forward foot. If you're feeling pressure in the calf of your forward foot, you're in the backseat and/or too spread. You can go knee to ski and still maintain forward pressure.

Uneven turns: It's pretty normal that you're more comfortable tele'ing in one direction versus the other - just like most everyone has a more comfortable food to lead with in snowboarding, tele (and alpine) is no different. Practice will even you out. Mono-marks are a pretty good drill for this, but make sure you're doing them effectively. Make sure you're in a good position, maintaining that cuff pressure. Really focus on engaging both edges of each ski when you transition.

Back ski pressure: Try and make this a focus. While learning, try and put 75%+ of your weight on that back ski (or what you think is that much). The reality will be you'll probably have a bit less than 50%. But exaggerating weight on the back ski initially will really let you learn control of that back ski. Once you start actively skiing on that back ski (and it's not just along for the ride), the general goal should be around a 50-50 weight distribution front to back. To really get the back foot feel, think of butt to heel, versus knee to ski. With butt to heel you'll be able to put a lot more pressure on the rear foot (try in on your carpet doing a lunge.

I'll leave it at that for now.

TomH--that's good stuff.

Since you don't have a lot to spend on lessons, I have some ideas that helped me a ton:
---Find and buy/borrow a "Joy of Telemark" DVD. It's put out by an organization that calls itself NATO (North American Telemark Association). It's almost everything you need to start to learn to telemark CORRECTLY. I can not over-exaggerate it's quality or value. Your "cuff pressure" issue is covered quite well, for example. Drills are provided that help reinforce all the lessons.

Another jumping in point that really helped me was a short series of videos that were found on the old TelemarkTips website by a guy named Urmas Franosch (I may a have spelled that incorrectly). Obviously, the site is gone, but his lessons are still floating about on YouTube. If you do find them, DO NOT just watch and they blow it off. Urmas speaks very slowly, but every word he uses is important. I have watched his lessons at least twenty times over the years, and each time I seem to hear something that I missed.

You want to really be careful about who you take "lessons" from, whether on the internet or in person. There is a lot of really bad advice that gets passed around. I would ideally have you take lessons from a certified instructor, emphasis on certified. Short of that, try the above two sources. I am a PSIA tele instructor, and I also teach alpine and telemark to our regional ski patrols. I use these sources (and others) for the basis of my instruction.

I will add one last thought: Please do not be in a rush. Go back to the basics. Study each step in your progression. You might find, as I did, that you really didn't know what you thought you did. Good luck!

Try stopping every time on your weak turn. It's great practice if you focus on making it clean, and will improve your turn in very little time.

So, I just re-watched an Urmas video for fun, before dragging myself off to the office (linking tele turns).
From your description (a delay in dropping the knee), and from the video, it ironically seems that you are actually practicing better technique on your supposed bad side, and rushing the lead change and knee drop on your supposed good side. Of course, I don't know exactly what you are doing, because I haven't seen it.

Any chance to short few videos and post them, so you can then be ripped apart? It will take large balls, but at least everyone else will get entertained.

Get that DVD and start from the beginning!

Where are you located? If you are in SLC, I'll take you out and show you some tricks. Barring that, just get out and ski. To develop your weaker side, always start from a stop turning that way- sounds stupid, but it helped me.

For steeper slopes try planting the pole way down, it worked for me.
You can probably find more stability by a stronger edging, what has worked for me is:
- charging little toe/big toe
- forcing your back heel down
- don't let your your back ski tip touch your other ski or boot
- try exagerate carving turns on blues or reds to practice the above
If you are hesitating on your lead change, probably focus more on edge change, which is far more important. You may delay lead change to the last quarter of the turn or so and take that hesitation out of the equation. Like an extension of the monomark exercise. Later on you figure out the right timing for you. Also think of moving back ski forward rather than the front ski back. As you step on your front ski to change leads you start charging early your next back ski.
All just intuitive advices based on my experience and interpretation of your situation, don't take them too seriously..

Where are you located? If you are in SLC, I'll take you out and show you some tricks. Barring that, just get out and ski. To develop your weaker side, always start from a stop turning that way- sounds stupid, but it helped me.

I am in SLC and have a pass to the Canyons/PCMR.

Any chance to short few videos and post them, so you can then be ripped apart? It will take large balls, but at least everyone else will get entertained.

I have actually thought about grabbing a video camera and having someone film me turning for an online pick apart.