Building an NNN-BC "downhill" setup?

[lilcliffy]

I too am VERY happy with the XCD stability and leverage of NNNBC. With the foot firmly seated on the binding platform- I get as much stability and leverage to drive and ride narrow skis as I need/want.

BTW- Mikael- are you using the standard black flexors in your bindings?

[mikael.oh]

My advice? Get the Fischers. You wont regret it.
I did the conversion and 400 Canadian is pretty much what they cost here in Norway as well. They're worth it!

BC gear is so cheap compared to ski de randonnée gear anyway. Just think about how much you save compared to that

Hei,
Who has fischer transnordic 75mm in stock in Norway?

Haven't looked at the 75mm version before but it looks like it's hard to find. Maybr send Fischer an email?

[mikael.oh]

I too am VERY happy with the XCD stability and leverage of NNNBC. With the foot firmly seated on the bidning platform- I get as much stability and leverage to drive and ride narrow skis as I need/want.

BTW- Mikael- are you using the standard black flexors in your bindings?

I haven't changed anything. Since I'm only doing alpime turns so far the flexors don't have much of an impact on the feel anyway.

[lilcliffy]

My advice? Get the Fischers. You wont regret it.
I did the conversion and 400 Canadian is pretty much what they cost here in Norway as well. They're worth it!

BC gear is so cheap compared to ski de randonnée gear anyway. Just think about how much you save compared to that

Hei,
Who has fischer transnordic 75mm in stock in Norway?

Not Norway- but decent price?
https://www.sport-conrad.com/en/product ... proof.html

[Nitram Tocrut]

Hey there free-heelers!

After several months of reading and learning on this forum, I finally decided to write something for myself.

In a nutshell, I already own a two pairs of backcountry skis mostly oriented towards flat to rolly terrains. Both are fitted with Rottefella NNN-BC Magnum bindings and used to be driven by soft Rossignol BCX6 boots. While these were really comfortable, performing telemark turns with them was truly an art, which nevertheless made me a good skier. Now that my BCX6 are beginning to fall appart, I'm planning on buying new NNN-BC boots*** and a new (yayy) pair of skis oriented towards downhill, to complete my quiver.

So far, I was quite impressed and inspired by this gentleman (https://www.telemarktalk.com/viewtopic. ... 3&start=10), who brought his Asnes Ingstad skis paired with Alpina Alaska BC boots to his local hill. And this is where I need your expertise. I'd like to achieve a similar feat and build the most optimal downhill-capable-ish NNN-BC setup, for telemark.

For the boots, a pair of Crispi Svartisen BC or Alpina Alaska BC looked like the most appealing option (any preference or other suggestions?). As for the skis, this is where the options are many. Being Québécois, I first look at the Altaï Ski Koms, which had a very short turn radius. However, these might be too wide for Svartisens or Alaskas to drive. Then, the Asnes Ingstad, Combat Nato, Nansen or Rabb 68 came to mind. However, I'd like to hear about your experience or opinion on this one too. I need short turn radius skis that can be turned on steeper terrain with Alaskas, Svartisen or similar boots, even on hard packed snow; IF such skis exist. I'm not too familiar with Madshus or Voilé skis, but I'm open to suggestions.

Any contribution (comments, advices, compliments, insults, etc.) is greatly appreciated. Thank you very much!

***I'd like to stick to NNN-BC boots for compatibility (and therefore, budget) reasons with the rest of my skis.

TL;DR: I need short turn radius skis that can be turned on steeper terrain with Alaskas, Svartisen or similar boots, even on hard packed snow; IF such skis exist.

I will do my best to help… but in exchange you have to get me to some of those places around Québec when I go back visiting my in-laws on l’Ile d’Orleans If you can reach @Rodbelan he could surely help as he probably ski some of the same spots as you do.

Of the ski mentioned I have the previous generation of FT and Rabb and you can find a lot of info on the forum. The Rabb is described by Asnes as a scale down AT ski and sure is fun but the terrain I easily have access to is not the best to get the most out of it but that could be a different story for you especially with the new version. It’s supposed to be better for the touring part which is a very good thing.But have not read real life report so far. As for the FT I flexed the new version in a store and they seem quite a different beast from the previous generation that I have.Asnes mentioned that they improved its touring hability and from I saw in the store I very believe so. We still have to get a report from @fisheater who bought the new version. The Rabb has a shorter radius than the FT but not as good for touring. I am not sure i would have bought those skis if I had tried them first on my terrain but that would be different if I had access to all the terrain you seem to have easy access to. They are both great skis but as many reported on the forum, they are a bit picky as for snow conditions.

I can’t say a real more about the other skis mentioned aside the Ingstad which is a great ski as you probably already reason the forum. But if you really are into XCD you should have a serious look at both the FT and Rabb if you go the Asnes way… but beware of the AGAS!!!

Finally, as mentioned by @lilcliffy I did try the TransNordic I store but I chose the Alaska as most of my skiing is on flat and rolling terrain plus a lot of narrow trail in the hills around my farm.The Fischer just felt too burly for what I mostly do but if I had to buy a NNNBC to be used mostly for XCD I would get them. I am new to NNNBC but I am already in love for the additional power and directional ability.

Hope that helped!

[fisheater]

I guess I missed this thread. The original poster was asking about a NNN-BC downhill set up. That new Trans Nordic boot seems like it has the downhill attributes, but may not be fun to kick and glide to the goods. The Alpina Alaska BC is a good combo boot.
If you mean downhill as the ability to make turns down the fall line I respectfully, but completely disagree with the posters suggesting double cambered skis. I strongly recommend a single camber, or maybe a camber and a half ski.
Skis in the class are Fischer S-112 and 98, Madshus Panorama 78 and the next size down 68? And from what I hear quite possibly the Panorama 62. Rossignol makes skis in this class however I don’t hear as many good reviews as the Fischer and Madshus. Alpina also makes a couple of skis in the Discovery series.
I have a new Falketind Xplore, I have not been out on it. I don’t quite have enough snow, I am currently bouncing my rock skis off of rocks, and only trail skiing. I believe the new FT has addressed all the complaints that were made about the previous model. I haven’t skied it, so I can’t say anything definitively.
A downhill turning ski gives up a lot of the XC performance of a double cambered ski. Now if your turning down trails that you could ride down on a mountain bike, the Ingstad is a XC made to kick and turn in soft snow. If your snow is more consolidated the Nansen would be a good choice. In SE Michigan where I live, my trails get packed down, and when it’s soft I’m looking for downhills and I am not skiing a double camber ski. However my trail ski is a Gamme, and I really like the ski. I ski our twisty, steep, up and down glacially deposited hills as fast as I can go. I go pretty fast downhill, but I generally make all the turns. Sometimes I need to make an emergency Sitzmark turn!
So I guess it goes to what you mean by downhill. However being able to turn a ski to change direction and linking turns and bending the ski in the process are two different things. Rocker on a XC ski also allows for a ski to turn more easily, but in reality it isn’t the same as a ski that bends in an arc. It’s actually the other side of the coin from true kick in a ski. Only a double camber ski really kicks. You can kick along on a single camber ski, and i have been on single camber skis that had a bit of kick in the right (for those skis) soft snow conditions. That didn’t mean they had anything close to the real kick of a double camber ski.
So the bottom line is decide what you want, and choose from there

[telerat]

Slightly off topic, but to me, especially having used these Fischer boots, the new Xplore system just seems like a way for Rottefella to charge rando prices for BC gear.

Off topic, but Rottefella's interest is obviously to increase the price and/or amount of bindings and soles sold.

Hopefully it will be a good, user-friendly and reliable system with performance to surpass the best 75mm 3-pin and NNN-BC binding and shoes. It avoids the snow packing of NNN-BC, allows step in and easy exit, with a wide connection without play like in NNN-BC and especially 75mm 3-pin. There is also much space for a large flexor and other mechanism in front of the Xplore binding. Without a metal bar or the duckbill in front it also promises better walking comfort. I think it could replace any 75mm and NNN-BC for my use, as NTN will fill the rest (together with ordinary NNN for prepared track use). This will of course make a large selection of good boots and binding obsolete, but it will take many years and they'll work just as good as before Xplore was launched. Rottefella has stated that Xplore is an addition and not a replacement of existing bindings.

Unfortunately patent(s) restricts innovation and we'll probably have to wait until later to realize the full potential as on NTN. We'll see if Xplore lives up to the promise.
/off topic.

If you are looking for just one boot for all your use, I'd go with Alpina Alaska BC or Alfa Svartisen BC, but I haven't tested the Fischer at all or the other two on skis. I have the Alfa Skaget Xplore which is similar to Alaska and that both has good support and xc performance, but is not a downhill boot for wide skis on icy conditions by any stretch. The Fischer Transnordic boot looks like it has more support than the other two and sacrificing touring comfort, but I haven't tried it on. Fischer BCX GT may be more similar to Alpina Alaska BC.

For having fun skiing turns on softer condition I'd go with a ski with a large sidecut like Rabb, Falketind, S-bound 98 or similar, but if the focus is on getting down icy descents the Gamme, Ousland or similar may be a better option unless the Fischer boot is stiff enough to drive the wider skis. As always fit is very important on shoes. Good luck.

[boby13]

I bought some Transnordic boots from skatepro.ca at Black Friday https://www.skatepro.ca/en/749-46494.htm ... 309 cad delivered to my door. But they are pretty much out of stock now. I didn't try them yet, not enough snow.

I just can say that they are a lot stiffer than Alaska's, probably the stiffest nnn-bc boot available. Also a little roomier than the Alaska but not ridiculously roomy like the Alfa Guard. (Alfa boots are only good if you ski 40miles per day every day and your feet are badly swollen )

[lilcliffy]

I bought some Transnordic boots from skatepro.ca at Black Friday https://www.skatepro.ca/en/749-46494.htm ... 309 cad delivered to my door. But they are pretty much out of stock now. I didn't try them yet, not enough snow.

I just can say that they are a lot stiffer than Alaska's, probably the stiffest nnn-bc boot available. Also a little roomier than the Alaska but not ridiculously roomy like the Alfa Guard. (Alfa boots are only good if you ski 40miles per day every day and your feet are badly swollen )

Damn! I noticed this sale too and they had already sold out of my size!!
Good to hear from you!
Please keep in touch and let us know how you make out with the Transnordic boot!
Gareth

[Lubega6]

Well

This post has generated great discussion since I last visited and I am very satisfied with everything above, I already love this community.

For now, the plan would be to wait for spring sales and try to catch either a Transnordic or Alaska boot fitting my size. I'll also be on the watch for either the FTs (forgot about these ones -thanks guys) or the Ingstad. I finally discarded the Rabbs because of their inferior versatility; as well as the Nansen, which dimensions are very similar to my actual entry-level, cheaper Rossignol BC80s. I agree that the comparison could be hasardous there, but I'd still like to experience something quite different than what I already know ski-wise.

Now, if I fall upon a good deal on a pair of Alpina Alaska boots, my only worry would be that they wouldn't be powerful enough to drive the larger skis on their edge on hard packed conditions. The Gammes would then become more interesting all of a sudden. We'll see.