Choosing my first off track skies

[Jalla]

Hi

I recently decided to get my first pair of skies not meant for xc.

The reason:
1. I want to joine some of my friends that use Randonee Skis with fixed heel on some of their trips. I get that i wont be as fast at them, but that does not matter that much to me. it just needs to be fun.

2. I want to use them for hunting, likely in deep snow.

The problem:
I have no experience in telemarking or turning with one ski in front of the other which seems like something i need to learn.

I have looked at åsnes skies and gone to some of the ski-stores in my area, but everyone recommend somtheing different.

What do you guys recommend?

[CwmRaider]

Hi and welcome!
Are you going to hunt with a dog? If so, steel edges are best avoided to lessen the risk of cutting their paws.
The two uses you describe are quite different, and a ski setup which is ideal for one, will be less ideal than the other.

Off track skis like Falketind and Ingstad are XC skis, with which you will be faster on flats and on not too steep uphills. When the hills get steeper, it is recommendable to have bindings which have "climbing wires" which allow you to rest your heels at an angle. In with these types of skis, this to me points to the use of a 75mm 3 pin binding with climbing wires, such as a Voile 3 Pin cable, Voile Traverse or Voile Hardwire, or a Rottefella Super Telemark Cable with riser plate and climbing wires.

Typical Randonnee bindings also allow for crampons to be mounted under the bindings for traversing steep icy terrain, this is not presently possible with 3 pin bindings AFAIK.

A set wide BC skis with Voile 3 pin traverse or Voile hardwire, with relatively beefy 75mm boots such as a Scarpa T4, would be quite vertical oriented. It would also be useable for hunting. But it would still be difficult to keep up in the downhills with with randonnee equipped skiers when the snow gets tricky.

If you need skis without steel edges the Åsnes Kongsvold could be a good option.
With steel edges, perhaps an Åsnes Falketind 62 is what comes to mind first, where a ski like the Åsnes Ingstad or Nansen would be more suitable for the flatter portions and less easy to ski in the downhills.
From Fischer an S-Bound 98 or 112 could be good waxless options.

[lowangle al]

I wouldn't think non metal edge skis are as critical for hunting with a dog as it is for ski jouring.

If I were going hunting on skis in the forest I would be on my widest ones. They would work like snowshoes. Snowshoes that can do beautiful things on the downhill.

[Jalla]

Hi and welcome!
Are you going to hunt with a dog? If so, steel edges are best avoided to lessen the risk of cutting their paws.
The two uses you describe are quite different, and a ski setup which is ideal for one, will be less ideal than the other.

Off track skis like Falketind and Ingstad are XC skis, with which you will be faster on flats and on not too steep uphills. When the hills get steeper, it is recommendable to have bindings which have "climbing wires" which allow you to rest your heels at an angle. In with these types of skis, this to me points to the use of a 75mm 3 pin binding with climbing wires, such as a Voile 3 Pin cable, Voile Traverse or Voile Hardwire, or a Rottefella Super Telemark Cable with riser plate and climbing wires.

Typical Randonnee bindings also allow for crampons to be mounted under the bindings for traversing steep icy terrain, this is not presently possible with 3 pin bindings AFAIK.

A set wide BC skis with Voile 3 pin traverse or Voile hardwire, with relatively beefy 75mm boots such as a Scarpa T4, would be quite vertical oriented. It would also be useable for hunting. But it would still be difficult to keep up in the downhills with with randonnee equipped skiers when the snow gets tricky.

If you need skis without steel edges the Åsnes Kongsvold could be a good option.
With steel edges, perhaps an Åsnes Falketind 62 is what comes to mind first, where a ski like the Åsnes Ingstad or Nansen would be more suitable for the flatter portions and less easy to ski in the downhills.
From Fischer an S-Bound 98 or 112 could be good waxless options.

Thank you for your reply

I dont hunt with a dog, so i would want a steel edge.

The falktind 62 seems like a good option. I dont mind going a little slow in the downhill as long as its fun.

Most of my friends are beginners at the rando thing. I dont think we will do the most extreme trips to start with. I have to learn telemark first anyways

[Ullr]

If you go for 75mm-bindings you can make the skis much more versatile by having two pair of shoes: A sturdy, but comfortable leather pair for hunting and touring, and a stiffer plastic pair (like the T4s recommended or the even stiffer T2) for rando days. FT 62 might be a good ski for this.

With this set-up you don’t have to do telemark turns. It is sturdy enough that you can do parallel turns. If you want to impress the ladies, however…

[fisheater]

The Falketind 62 is a fun ski. I have one and really like it. However it is soft. If you’re breaking trail in more than 20 cm of snow you will have the ski arcing uphill due to that soft flex. If you are going uphill in 30 cm of snow, the Falketind will be a lot of extra work on the climb. It will be fun downhill in 30 cm of fresh if you are toasted from the climb. The biggest benefit of the Falketind is that it is light and just turns easily in Alpina Alaska class boots.
Now if you’re expecting more exposed alpine snow you will probably be best served by a more alpine ski. I’ve never seen a Rabb, or Nosi. I’m not sure if they have what it takes to handle alpine snow in all conditions. I have a set of Tindan 86. I cannot tell you how they ski, but they are heavier and stiffer than the Falketind. I can’t say they will ski like a dream. I can say I expect them to be competent in alpine terrain and snow. This ski would be best matched with a light plastic boot such as a T-4 / Excursion. There are quite a few offerings in that mid eighty to ninety mm range. When I speak of alpine snow I refer to snow generally exposed to sun and wind except when protected by higher elevations. In the trees, snow can be soft and preserved for quite some time as long as it stays cold.
As for crampons on a 75 mm binding, Voile make these.
https://www.voile.com/voile-crampons.html

[connyro]

I wouldn't think non metal edge skis are as critical for hunting with a dog as it is for ski jouring.

If I were going hunting on skis in the forest I would be on my widest ones. They would work like snowshoes. Snowshoes that can do beautiful things on the downhill.

I'm with Al on this one. I would want as much stability as possible for hunting. I would also want a wider alpine type ski for the ski touring with your friends that you are describing. Going against the grain of this site's typicaI Asnes obsession, I would choose my Voile vector bcs and t4s or Excursions and 3-pins for the skiing that you describe.

[lilcliffy]

I agree with Conny and Al as well.

Group ski touring with incompatible gear (between skiers) is terrible and can even be dangerous in mountainous terrain.

AT/Randonne setups are designed to climb up and ski downhill.
Whether or not your tour partners are expert downhill skiers- you still want a setup that is compatible with your ski partners.

The "telemark" is a ski turn- one of many- and it is not the only or necessarily always the best turn.

If you are going skiing in the mountains- with tour partners that are on AT setups- you want a compatible setup.

If you want one setup for both of the contexts you describe- then 75mm bindings- and perhaps a 3-pin binding with removable cable- is the way to go- you can have two different boots:
1) one light comfy BC-XC boot for shuffing around on gentle terrain
2) one Telemark boot for skiing mountainous terrain (and I would go plastic to start)

Don't choose a setup that will get you to the top of a mountain that you cannot safely ski down!!!

As fas as skis- I personally lean towards upper 90s ~100mm underfoot for a "quiver of-one" downhill-focused backcountry ski (also ideal for shuffling around in the dense bush on very deep snow).
(I am personally not yet sold on mid 80s skis for BC downhill skiing- inbounds, yes.)
The recommendation of the Voile Vector/Ultravector- or similar ski- I second that recommendation.

[lilcliffy]

And my comment about the "telemark" turn ↑

My point is that if you are planning on going out touring in the mountains-

You need to be stable on a mountainside and be able to comfortably pressure your ski into a turn- if you do not have advanced downhill-Nordic skills, you need downhill skis and boots to do this.

Worry about mastering the telemark turn later.
Don't get hurt.

[Jalla]

I agree with Conny and Al as well.

Group ski touring with incompatible gear (between skiers) is terrible and can even be dangerous in mountainous terrain.

AT/Randonne setups are designed to climb up and ski downhill.
Whether or not your tour partners are expert downhill skiers- you still want a setup that is compatible with your ski partners.

The "telemark" is a ski turn- one of many- and it is not the only or necessarily always the best turn.

If you are going skiing in the mountains- with tour partners that are on AT setups- you want a compatible setup.

If you want one setup for both of the contexts you describe- then 75mm bindings- and perhaps a 3-pin binding with removable cable- is the way to go- you can have two different boots:
1) one light comfy BC-XC boot for shuffing around on gentle terrain
2) one Telemark boot for skiing mountainous terrain (and I would go plastic to start)

Don't choose a setup that will get you to the top of a mountain that you cannot safely ski down!!!

As fas as skis- I personally lean towards upper 90s ~100mm underfoot for a "quiver of-one" downhill-focused backcountry ski (also ideal for shuffling around in the dense bush on very deep snow).
(I am personally not yet sold on mid 80s skis for BC downhill skiing- inbounds, yes.)
The recommendation of the Voile Vector/Ultravector- or similar ski- I second that recommendation.

Hi

Thanks for your answer.

Are you saying i should not get a BC "telemark" type ski at all and go for rando?

i hate to miss the possibility to go cabin to cabin and hunting with the skies, but if that is a much better option then maybe rando it is